Who
Shaun Sutner, Snowsports columnist for the Worcester Telegram & Gazette & Telegram.com.
Date Recorded
Nov. 2, 2026
The take up top
The modern accessibility of western skiing is mostly due to a pair of transportation revolutions that slashed travel time into harsh, high, and once-remote mountains over the past several decades. The first is the Interstate Highway System, which cracked the Colorado Rockies, the Wasatch, Lake Tahoe, New England, and other regions open to the masses. The second has been the quiet increase in direct flights from major population centers into rural airports such as Jackson, Vail-Eagle, Friedman (Sun Valley), and Yampa (Steamboat). The success of the Epic and Ikon passes is at least in part due to the ease with which skiers in Chicago, New York, Atlanta, Dallas, and Los Angeles can reach airports near otherwise-walled-in-by-nature destinations such as Big Sky, Snowbird, Taos, and Aspen. My favorite is American Airlines’ early-morning direct flight to Vail-Eagle out of JFK, which, when considering the two hours travelers pick up flying west, puts me on Vail’s Born Free Express before lunchtime.
So small changes in airline routing can impact skier patterns in a big way, which is why I took the first few minutes of this show to itemize a few subtractions and additions to ski-town plane routes ahead of this winter. Here’s The Travel article that I referenced in my overview.
Why I interviewed him
You may have caught part one of SutnerFest yesterday. If not:
That show focused on acquisitions and mountain upgrades. In this episode, we talk through our favorite New England ski areas, and itemize the New England ski lifts we think are most in need of updating. I did a similar exercise with Matthew Zebransky of Midwest Skiers in September:
Transcripts
There are two transcripts. Both are generated by robots. Both are helpful and defective in their own unique ways. I do not proofread either of them.
Transcript 1: Click the “transcript” button at the top of this article. You can only see this transcript on a computer. Because I don’t know why exactly but everything is getting better and dumber all at once it seems. Anyway, this is the transcript that the robots create when I upload the podcast to the internet. The cool thing about it is that you can click on any block of text and the audio will teleport there instantly. The uncool thing about this transcript is that it does not indicate who is talking at any given moment.
Transcript 2: You can read this below. This is the transcript that Zoom creates as we record the podcast. The cool thing about this transcript is that it indicates who is talking at any given moment. The uncool thing about this transcript is that the timestamps do not match the audio. Also, you cannot click on this text to move to the associated point in the audio.
Zoom
Stuart Winchester: Alright, joining us again is Sean Suttner, very good friend of the Storm. He has been covering New England skiing as the snow sports columnist for the Worcester Telegram and Gazette and Telegram.com for more than two decades. Sean Suttner joins us once again.
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Stuart Winchester: Sean, let’s break down some resorts. So… so we’re gonna… we’re gonna give our…
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Stuart Winchester: Five favorite New England resorts. We might have some bonus ones, and mine are not necessarily in any particular order, but I’ll let Sean go first, and then I’ll give mine. We’ll just alternate back and forth, and I did this with Matthew Zabransky in the Midwest. It was a lot of fun.
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SutnerS: Oh?
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Stuart Winchester: So, Sean, give us your first and let us know, are these in order or not? Because I can’t order mine.
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SutnerS: Wait, so it’s like a snake draft, or I just go, uh, I just give by 5?
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Stuart Winchester: Just give your five, uh, and then I’ll… well, no, no, give… no, give one, break down why it is, and then I’ll do one.
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SutnerS: Give one. Okay.
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Stuart Winchester: And then we’ll switch back and forth.
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SutnerS: Okay.
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SutnerS: All right, I’m gonna give you Stowe as number one.
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SutnerS: That’s my number one favorite. I’ve been skiing it the longest. It’s what Vail is to national ski resorts, so is to New England ski resorts. It’s got the gnarliest skiing, the best vibe, the best opera. You can tell that to your producer.
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Stuart Winchester: I mean.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: Um, it is, uh, I don’t know, I don’t think, I think it’s unrivaled.
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Stuart Winchester: I agree, and that was my number one as well, and we won’t… I don’t think we’ll all be matched. Me and Sean did not share what we were doing here, but I think that…
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SutnerS: No.
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Stuart Winchester: Vail putting that six pack over where that triple was was brilliant.
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SutnerS: You cut out. I can’t hear you. Oh, I couldn’t hear that.
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Stuart Winchester: Great.
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Stuart Winchester: Oh.
00:40:08.000 --> 00:40:09.000
Stuart Winchester: Let’s see.
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SutnerS: Sorry, you froze briefly.
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Stuart Winchester: Uh, did I mute?
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Stuart Winchester: Oh, my internet connection is unstable, it says.
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Stuart Winchester: Are you hearing me? No, it says mine. Are you hearing me?
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SutnerS: Well, bye.
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SutnerS: I’m hearing you.
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SutnerS: I’m hearing you.
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Stuart Winchester: Okay. All right. Okay, so let me…
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Stuart Winchester: start that one over, and I’ll just…
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SutnerS: Wait, you can’t keep the snow part?
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Stuart Winchester: No, no, no, I will, I will. Yeah, yeah, no, I’ll keep yours, I’ll just re-record mine. Um, and Patricia will, uh, will edit this nicely, I’ll just warn her that this is, uh…
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SutnerS: Okay.
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SutnerS: You’re freezing a little too. I never know if this is my connection or somebody else’s connection. Yeah.
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Stuart Winchester: Am I?
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Stuart Winchester: Gosh, it, uh… hmm.
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SutnerS: Now you’re fine.
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Stuart Winchester: Am I? Okay, look, look.
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SutnerS: Well, your little, uh, back’s headroom.
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Stuart Winchester: Sorry, am I alright? Yeah.
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SutnerS: A little. Now you’re fine. Now you’re fine.
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Stuart Winchester: Okay, okay. Well, let’s see how it goes. Alright, so…
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Stuart Winchester: So it’s cool you say that, Sean, because… and Sean and I did not share what we were gonna…
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Stuart Winchester: what our top 5 were, but Stowe is also my favorite ski area in New England. Here’s the trail map up.
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Stuart Winchester: What Vail did with putting this six pack over here with this awesome, awesome intermediate terrain over on Mount Mansfield was just brilliant because it really encouraged, because there used to be a triple and you had to climb all these stairs to get up there. And with a six pack here, it’s really taken a lot of pressure, I think.
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Stuart Winchester: off of the 4Runner quad and the gondola, and Stowe is just huge, and what I really, really, really love about it is that even the stuff that’s not marked Glades is pretty much Glades. It’s… I don’t know if they’ve thinned it, if it’s just old growth, but it is phenomenal Glades, and for a long time, I was saying Jay Peak was the best in New England.
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Stuart Winchester: After I skied Stowe the last two years, I’m changing it back to Stowe because it is just such a great mountain. I mean, there’s a little awkwardness getting in the Overeasy Gondola over to Spruce Peak, and that’s the one, by the way, that you would connect to Smugs with, but overall, I just think Stowe is phenomenal.
00:42:07.000 --> 00:42:09.000
Stuart Winchester: Alright, Sean, what’s your number 4?
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SutnerS: Um, oh, me, my number, my second most favorite.
00:42:13.000 --> 00:42:16.000
Stuart Winchester: Your next one. Yeah, second.
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SutnerS: Uh, Berkshire East.
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Stuart Winchester: Berkshire East.
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Stuart Winchester: And why?
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SutnerS: Well, because I like steep skiing. And from the top of Berkshire East, you have a choice of about 12 pure steeps.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: Um, which is unbelievable. I, uh, it skis… I know there’s a cliche, but it skis a lot bigger than it is at 1,000 vertical feet. Um, it’s got… it’s got the best vibe. It’s like Magic, or Mad River, or… or JP Vibe.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: Right here in Massachusetts, I have, uh, nostalgic ties for it. I’ve been skiing there, um, steadily for 7 or more years, and really for about 18 years. Uh…
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: It’s got just you don’t have to see this. You don’t have to ski the same trail twice.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: which is amazing for a Southern New England ski area. I don’t know. It’s just the terrain. There’s something about the terrain there that is just as good as anything up north, north, north, except that it lacks about that extra 1,000 or 1,500 vertical.
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Stuart Winchester: I agree, I love Berkshire East, I love the Glades, and you’ve seen it evolve from what it was, and that’s where I was saying that John Schaefer, in our last episode, really loves to develop his mountains. So my number 2…
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Stuart Winchester: And…
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Stuart Winchester: This, again, I’m going kind of chalky with mine, like I did with the Midwest. So my number 2 is Sugarbush, and I just… I love this freakin’ mountain, because it is just so, so, so big.
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SutnerS: Yes.
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Stuart Winchester: and I have the trail map up here on, uh, on YouTube at stormskiing.com, and, uh, this is the interactive trail map, but right up here.
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Stuart Winchester: Well, this is…
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Stuart Winchester: I’m gonna get outta here and do a better one. So the Castle Rock pod is, is no snowmaking.
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Stuart Winchester: Uh, it’s a double chair. It’s just as fierce as anything at Mad River Glen. I really hate these interactive trail maps. They’re, like, they’re very awkward. You know, I just want the trail map, trail map. Uh, so let me try to pull that up here.
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SutnerS: I know.
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SutnerS: Yeah.
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Stuart Winchester: And…
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SutnerS: Castle Rock is where you go to damage your skis, by the way.
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Stuart Winchester: You know what, though? What’s great about Castle Rock is even into April, it’ll be open on good snow years, and they have just… they rarely, rarely groom it, and Win Smith told me when he was on the podcast several years ago, they only groom it maybe once or twice a year, and so the bumps get really, really huge, and because there’s an intimidation factor.
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SutnerS: No.
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Stuart Winchester: it doesn’t get a lot of traffic, so the… the mountain does stay good for a long time. So, uh, the snow does, rather. So right here…
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Stuart Winchester: I just need to be more prepared, I think, Sean. I’m just…
00:45:01.000 --> 00:45:03.000
Stuart Winchester: Being a clown today with this stuff.
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SutnerS: I get confused by tabs, uh, all the time, so…
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, I know. Alright, so here’s Sugarbush, and Sugarbush… so here, a couple fun facts about Sugarbush. Number one, it’s connected by the Slidebook Brook Express, which is the longest chairlift in the world.
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SutnerS: Have you ever written it?
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Stuart Winchester: Yes, I have. Have you?
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SutnerS: Oh, so am I. It’s an experience like no other.
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, I wish they would open it more…
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Stuart Winchester: I don’t understand…
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Stuart Winchester: Sugarbush’s insistence that you have to have snow beneath it to be able to rescue people. I mean, have you ever ridden the peak-to-peak at Whistler?
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SutnerS: I know.
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SutnerS: Hang on.
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Stuart Winchester: It’s 1,400 feet off the valley floor. I mean, there must be another way, so it doesn’t run as much as it should, but on the Mount Allen side is some of the best fall line skiing in New England, and I just love just the variety of terrain. Sugarbush just…
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SutnerS: Nope.
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Stuart Winchester: to me, it… it feels like a western ski area with how big it is, with how good the snow quality is, and I always make this point, that…
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Stuart Winchester: area from Sugarbush up to Mad River Glen, Bolton Valley, Stowe, Smuggler’s Notch, and Jay Peak, they get twice the snow as anyone else in New England, anywhere from 250 to 400 inches in a year, and it is really… you… you… if you want reliable glades, that is where you go.
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Stuart Winchester: in New England. So Sugarbush is my number two. What is your number three, Sean?
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SutnerS: Good question about Sugar Rush. Why is there no high-speed quad to the top? A high-speed lift of any kind?
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, sure. Yeah.
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Stuart Winchester: Oh, well, so…
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Stuart Winchester: The reason is because the fixed grip lifts.
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Stuart Winchester: are less susceptible to icing.
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Stuart Winchester: So you’ll see that in a lot of ski areas.
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SutnerS: Yes.
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Stuart Winchester: the… I think probably…
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Stuart Winchester: like, Tamarack in Idaho… not Tamarack, Schweitzer in Idaho, and Tom Chassie is the one who explained this to me. It’s like, you have the thick scripts at the top, and he came from New England, he’s a New England guy.
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Stuart Winchester: Because the high speeds, the detaches, just get iced up. And they used to have, as you know, a gondola from the base to the top of Sugarbush, and they had to split it. Same reason with Sugarloaf.
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Stuart Winchester: Because then when the top is out, you can still ski the bottom. That’s my understanding. It’s not that they couldn’t run a high speed at the top, because you look at a place, like, I just had, uh, Mount Bachelor.
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Stuart Winchester: President John Merriman on, and they have a high-speed quad on their summit, and that is nasty weather, but they have a bar.
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SutnerS: But why do every other New England skier of any repute has high speed to the summit except for Sugarloaf, Sugarbush, and that’s about it? Oh, I get you.
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah. Yeah.
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, they figure it out. So, you know, Alterra’s there now, Alterra owns Sugarbush, so maybe they’ll figure it out. And the way that Bachelor does that at the top is they run the line at a low speed all night, and they have a barn for the chairs, so…
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SutnerS: Sure, you need a bond for the choice, but I’m a little disappointed in Altera for not investing more in sugar bush lifts.
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, we’ll get to lifts in a minute. What’s your number 3 resort in New England, Sean?
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SutnerS: All right.
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SutnerS: Uh, this is counterintuitive as well. Add attach.
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Stuart Winchester: Aditash. Tell us, why Aditash?
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SutnerS: Editas has the most imaginative, classic trails from the summit, which is now eminently skiable with the new high-speed quad that Vail put in the Mountaineer a couple of years ago. I mean, their trails take…
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: twists where nobody else’s take twists plus. You have Bear Peak. You have tremendous amount of variety over Bear Peak. You have the steep, the steep, long race trails over here. You have.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:48:21.000 --> 00:48:22.000
Stuart Winchester: Mm-hmm.
00:48:29.000 --> 00:48:30.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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SutnerS: steep right in here. You have big, wide boulevards over here. You…
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Stuart Winchester: Well, just to say where, because they… not everyone’s… I can’t see where you’re pointing.
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SutnerS: Oh, okay, so to Skier’s right is the more, from Bear Peak is the more like intermediate stuff. Really gnarly stuff, right under the quad, what’s that called, the Flying Bear or something?
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, I’m bad at lists, I’m bad at names.
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SutnerS: Um, what’s it called? The…
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SutnerS: All right, whatever the high-speed quad is at the top of Bear Peak. Well, that actually needs to be replaced. It’s been down a lot over the last few years. But from the skier’s left and right under the chair at Bear Peak is some really gnarly, sustained steeps.
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Stuart Winchester: Okay.
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Stuart Winchester: Mm-hmm.
00:49:13.000 --> 00:49:22.000
SutnerS: which I love, and actually accessible by by advanced intermediates as well. And then these looking at at attach.
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SutnerS: And they’re connected nicely, these two peaks. The four trails from the top of Attitash are just…
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:49:30.000 --> 00:49:31.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:49:32.000 --> 00:49:33.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:49:32.000 --> 00:49:44.000
SutnerS: gnarly. Uh, one of them is, uh, I think Sacco is more advanced intermediate, blue square, really a legitimate one. And then even the lower part of that attached, you can come flying over some of these, uh.
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SutnerS: These… these cross, uh, trails here, and just literally catch about 20 feet of air before you… before you land somewhere on this black diamond in lower, uh…
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:49:56.000 --> 00:50:09.000
SutnerS: you know, one of those. And then they have a couple of surprising bumper runs that nobody knows about over here. Their intermediate terrain over here is actually great for solid intermediates.
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Stuart Winchester: Over where?
00:50:07.000 --> 00:50:09.000
Stuart Winchester: I’m out of cash.
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Stuart Winchester: Okay.
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SutnerS: Yeah.
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SutnerS: Right where they put the new, uh, low-speed quad.
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Stuart Winchester: Yeah, Vale’s done a really good job with that attached with these two new lifts. My number three is one we’ve talked about already quite a bit. It is Smuggler’s Notch. And we, we talked about that on the last episode and people can listen if they want, but it’s, it is.
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Stuart Winchester: It’s a little hard to get to.
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Stuart Winchester: families love it, because there’s a lot of places to stay on the mountain. I just think it gets…
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Stuart Winchester: overlooked because of the slower lifts, and I’m gonna say…
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Stuart Winchester: Don’t overlook it because of the slower lifts, because that actually…
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Stuart Winchester: A lot of other people are thinking the same thing. So it, it, it, there are lift lines there, but they move well. You know, it, it, the Madonna, it’s that long quad. It’s the longest double, or I’m sorry, double chair. It’s the longest one in America. But it, it goes quick as an expert pod and it rarely stops. You know, people know what they’.
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Stuart Winchester: when they get there. So, I’m going number 3 is Smugs. Uh, what’s your number 4, Sean?
00:51:13.000 --> 00:51:17.000
SutnerS: Another counterintuitive one, I think, it’s Cannon Mountain in New Hampshire.
00:51:16.000 --> 00:51:17.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay?
00:51:17.000 --> 00:51:33.000
SutnerS: It’s just an expert skier’s paradise, or advanced skier’s paradise. The bottom front four are just amazing. They go right down to the valley.
00:51:31.000 --> 00:51:32.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:51:33.000 --> 00:51:49.000
SutnerS: The tree skiing over at Mintersil is insane. The the race complex to lookers right from the advertised base is phenomenal. They have one of the best outdoor bars in New England, the Cannonball.
00:51:49.000 --> 00:52:05.000
SutnerS: bar, and I’m not big on opera writing about opera just as you are not either, but I still want to sing a lot. They also have a great bar at the top of Cannon Men, unfortunately not served by a tram, probably in our lifetime. But.
00:52:05.000 --> 00:52:11.000
SutnerS: Just kidding about that. Oh, and these two trails here, DJ’s tram line, I mean, it just…
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Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:52:11.000 --> 00:52:19.000
SutnerS: Hardly anyone can actually ski that. It’s that hard. This trail here, have you ever skied this one, Kisbens Glade?
00:52:13.000 --> 00:52:14.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah.
00:52:18.000 --> 00:52:21.000
Stuart Winchester: No, it’s never been opened when I was there.
00:52:21.000 --> 00:52:36.000
SutnerS: It is just insane. I mean, there’s there’s moguls the size of my house there, and it’s super steep and super skinny and super long. It’s it’s pretty amazing. Middlesil. It’s racing, and it’s woods.
00:52:36.000 --> 00:52:53.000
SutnerS: in this little ridge coming off the top of cannon 2 meter. So that’s quite a odyssey to get there. And then in here you can’t pick out that many blue squares up here. I mean, they really should be black diamonds. They call them blue squares.
00:52:41.000 --> 00:52:42.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:52:52.000 --> 00:52:55.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay, you mean, you mean right here off of, uh…
00:52:55.000 --> 00:52:57.000
Stuart Winchester: Gremlin, is that what it’s.
00:52:57.000 --> 00:52:58.000
Stuart Winchester: Is that Gremlin?
00:52:58.000 --> 00:53:05.000
SutnerS: Off of the… no, off of the… uh, yeah, that left there, the… just the high-speed quad from the bottom.
00:52:58.000 --> 00:53:00.000
Stuart Winchester: That is Gremlin.
00:53:04.000 --> 00:53:05.000
Stuart Winchester: Yah.
00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:07.000
SutnerS: Yeah, Gremlin, yeah.
00:53:05.000 --> 00:53:21.000
Stuart Winchester: And so, fun fact for people who are not familiar, this over here is actually the interstate. That’s how close Canada is off the interstate. And to get there, coming from the south, you go through, as far as I know, the only place in the United States interstate system.
00:53:21.000 --> 00:53:30.000
Stuart Winchester: goes to a single lane, going through Franconia Notch. It used to be where Old Man on the Mountain is, but it fell down. I like that play. For my…
00:53:23.000 --> 00:53:26.000
SutnerS: Yeah. Yeah.
00:53:30.000 --> 00:53:41.000
Stuart Winchester: Number 4, however, again, I’m going chalky with these, because in case someone’s listening outside of New England, I want them to know, uh, some of the top ski areas, so I’m going JPEAK.
00:53:41.000 --> 00:53:51.000
Stuart Winchester: which is known for glades, but also just the snowiest ski area in New England, and they’ve really…
00:53:42.000 --> 00:53:43.000
SutnerS: Court.
00:53:51.000 --> 00:54:02.000
Stuart Winchester: built up, Jay. You can stay right on the mountain, and they have this water park, and I know some people think that’s cheesy, and I know some people think, oh, you know, you should just care about the skiing, but…
00:54:02.000 --> 00:54:09.000
Stuart Winchester: You know, the truth is, once you have kids, I think you appreciate, like, the reason I…
00:54:08.000 --> 00:54:11.000
SutnerS: It’s not cheesy, it’s a fantastic water park.
00:54:10.000 --> 00:54:25.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, I mean, the reason that I take my family to Greek Peak, New York, of all places, every MLK weekend, is because they have a hotel and a water park on site, and that’s very rare in New England. They’re also very reasonably priced. But here’s JP. JP just…
00:54:25.000 --> 00:54:43.000
Stuart Winchester: It has phenomenal terrain. I mean, basically, its acreage is only listed at 400-something, but it is much, much bigger. It skis so big, and you can ski almost all these glades. You can get yourself in trouble and ski down to the road if you want. It, you know, it doesn’t have the fastest lifts. It has just the one high-speed quad right here.
00:54:27.000 --> 00:54:28.000
SutnerS: Yeah.
00:54:43.000 --> 00:54:51.000
Stuart Winchester: Uh, the tram is often down for wind, and we can talk about that in a minute, but JPEAK is my number 4. Where are you going with number 5, Sean?
00:54:50.000 --> 00:54:58.000
SutnerS: That’s a great pick, Stu. I’m so sad I couldn’t include that in mine. I’m going to Sugarloaf for number five.
00:54:53.000 --> 00:54:55.000
Stuart Winchester: That’s right.
00:54:56.000 --> 00:54:58.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay.
00:54:58.000 --> 00:55:13.000
SutnerS: Uh, arguably the biggest ski area in New England, neck and neck with Killington. Uh, I’ve been skiing it since my college days. It is, um, got a, uh, just a scary series of steeps up at the top.
00:55:03.000 --> 00:55:04.000
Stuart Winchester: Yep.
00:55:13.000 --> 00:55:21.000
SutnerS: It’s got crazy weather, which doesn’t necessarily go to the plus side.
00:55:21.000 --> 00:55:26.000
SutnerS: It is — there’s just something about that mountain, how long the runs are.
00:55:26.000 --> 00:55:32.000
SutnerS: Uh, it’s just, it looks really steep on this map, and it actually is really steep at the top.
00:55:33.000 --> 00:55:40.000
SutnerS: Um, I don’t know, it’s just got an us-against-the-world mentality when you’re up there during a storm, you know?
00:55:39.000 --> 00:55:53.000
Stuart Winchester: Man, it is… it is a haul to get there, but it is worth it. And you know what, Sean? That was actually also my number 5. So, I just wanna… I wanna give some stats here for people who are not familiar with… with Sugarloaf. So, Sugarloaf…
00:55:53.000 --> 00:55:56.000
Stuart Winchester: has a…
00:55:56.000 --> 00:56:09.000
Stuart Winchester: 2,748-foot vertical drop, and it claims 1,360 acres. Now, just to break that down for people and what that means, Killington also claims a 3,000-foot vertical drop, but…
00:56:09.000 --> 00:56:20.000
Stuart Winchester: But, but, but, really the only great fall line skiing is on Killington Mountain, and to get that last 1500, you really have to go through some kind of bummer terrain. Sugar Bush and Sugar Loaf.
00:56:20.000 --> 00:56:35.000
Stuart Winchester: Are really the best top to bottom fall line. And if you’re, if you’re looking at this trail map on, on, uh, storm skiing.com or YouTube Storm Ski Journal, you can see these just long, long, long cruising trails. They let stuff bump up. And over here, I just love this Bracket Basin and Burnt Mountain.
00:56:35.000 --> 00:56:51.000
Stuart Winchester: Uh, what was a, a huge expansion that Boeing did, and it’s really sets up for how they’re gonna do their loon expansion that they recently announced on Black Ridge. And, and it, it’s essentially, they just went in and gladed it. And you can ride a snow cat up to Bird Mountain. You can come down through the glades.
00:56:51.000 --> 00:57:07.000
Stuart Winchester: And it is just such a great place. The only one thing I would say is you can’t lap bracket basin with one lift. I wouldn’t mind a surface lift or some kind of primitive lift over here, but that’s a knit. I agree with you, Sean. Sugarloaf is the best.
00:57:07.000 --> 00:57:13.000
Stuart Winchester: All right, so let’s, let’s move on, Sean, to our favorite, or, or…
00:57:13.000 --> 00:57:15.000
Stuart Winchester: The five?
00:57:15.000 --> 00:57:17.000
Stuart Winchester: Lifts in New England.
00:57:17.000 --> 00:57:22.000
Stuart Winchester: that you believe should be upgraded next? Because I have this chart to show you.
00:57:22.000 --> 00:57:24.000
Stuart Winchester: Uh, so, uh.
00:57:23.000 --> 00:57:27.000
SutnerS: There’s probably been three honorable mentions for the ski areas.
00:57:25.000 --> 00:57:28.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, go ahead, do that while I’m pulling this up.
00:57:27.000 --> 00:57:34.000
SutnerS: I’ll just mention them, we won’t talk about it. Stratton, Killington, and Whiteface, even though it’s not in New.
00:57:28.000 --> 00:57:31.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, talk. Mm-hmm.
00:57:32.000 --> 00:57:35.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay, okay, give us one sentence on each.
00:57:36.000 --> 00:57:40.000
SutnerS: Stratton, it’s a big, big mountain in southern Vermont.
00:57:39.000 --> 00:57:40.000
Stuart Winchester: Mm-hmm.
00:57:40.000 --> 00:57:57.000
SutnerS: Gillington is got is it’s the biggest ski area in New England. It really is with on piece stuff. Whiteface is like taking Aspen and plunking it down in the Adirondacks. It is. It is so long, so steep.
00:57:44.000 --> 00:57:45.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:57:46.000 --> 00:57:48.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
00:57:52.000 --> 00:57:53.000
Stuart Winchester: Right.
00:57:57.000 --> 00:58:01.000
SutnerS: So big, such great lifts. That’s it.
00:58:00.000 --> 00:58:12.000
Stuart Winchester: I’ll do my three honorable mentions, too. So my first was Berkshire East, because I just love the terrain there, I think it’s such a sleeper. Black Mountain, New Hampshire, I love what Eric’s doing there, it is a party, it is fun.
00:58:12.000 --> 00:58:17.000
Stuart Winchester: blowing up the revenue. He’s showing how an independent ski area.
00:58:17.000 --> 00:58:19.000
Stuart Winchester: Can.
00:58:19.000 --> 00:58:37.000
Stuart Winchester: go from almost dying to really just by flexing and taking a different orientation toward the world. And I know sometimes Eric gets in scuffles with local officials and such, but I love what he’s doing there. It’s a big party. And my third honorable mention is Yagu, New Hampshire. I know you love Yagu, too. I mention it because my daughter is in college.
00:58:37.000 --> 00:58:44.000
Stuart Winchester: in Rhode Island, and uh… and I also skied Yagu, uh… was it last year or the year before? Anyway, it was…
00:58:37.000 --> 00:58:39.000
SutnerS: Broadcast.
00:58:43.000 --> 00:58:45.000
SutnerS: I’ve skied it 3 times.
00:58:44.000 --> 00:58:46.000
Stuart Winchester: So fun. So fun. Just…
00:58:46.000 --> 00:58:50.000
SutnerS: It is. I love the heart. They live. It’s amazing. Yeah.
00:58:46.000 --> 00:58:48.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, yeah.
00:58:48.000 --> 00:58:53.000
Stuart Winchester: It looks like an antique, it’s like old double chairs, and it’s, you know…
00:58:53.000 --> 00:59:08.000
Stuart Winchester: mostly kids, and there’s, like, cartoon dogs all over the place. It’s just… it’s weird, and I just love it, and I hope that they’re in business forever. So I wanna… I wanna show you something to set up our next segment here, Sean. So we… you and I have talked a lot about.
00:59:08.000 --> 00:59:16.000
Stuart Winchester: all of the Lyft investment in New England over the past 10 years, and New England was very behind, and here I have up…
00:59:16.000 --> 00:59:20.000
Stuart Winchester: some totals. So over the… since 2016.
00:59:20.000 --> 00:59:35.000
Stuart Winchester: New England, the, the six New England states, the 100 ski areas in the six New England states have installed 64 new lifts. These are some impressive numbers that includes two eight packs, eight six packs, one gondola, 11 high speed quads, four fixed grip quads.
00:59:35.000 --> 00:59:51.000
Stuart Winchester: 9 triples, 3 doubles, and I couldn’t believe this one. I had to double check. 11 T-bars. If you would have asked me, I would have said 3 or 4, but that’s kind of phenomenal. It’s probably more than they put up since the 60s. However, this year.
00:59:51.000 --> 00:59:58.000
Stuart Winchester: We only have two new lifts in New England. Uh, one at Hermitage Club, which most people won’t even be able to ski. It’s, it’s.
00:59:58.000 --> 01:00:08.000
Stuart Winchester: I guess a detachable quad, I thought that was affixed, but it’s, uh, I think parallel to the six-pack as a redundant lift. And then at Killington, they replaced the Snowden triple.
01:00:04.000 --> 01:00:05.000
SutnerS: It is.
01:00:05.000 --> 01:00:07.000
SutnerS: Yep.
01:00:08.000 --> 01:00:23.000
Stuart Winchester: with a fixed 4. Which takes me to our exercise here. What are the 5 lifts that you would like to see upgraded in New England? We’ll do the same thing, we’ll take turns back and forth. So, uh, give me… start with number 5 this time. We’ll count down.
01:00:24.000 --> 01:00:29.000
SutnerS: So, sorry, with the least urgent to be replaced?
01:00:26.000 --> 01:00:28.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:00:29.000 --> 01:00:35.000
SutnerS: OK, I’m going to say, well, the jade tramp.
01:00:34.000 --> 01:00:35.000
Stuart Winchester: Huh-huh.
01:00:36.000 --> 01:00:37.000
Stuart Winchester: Why?
01:00:38.000 --> 01:00:41.000
SutnerS: It’s… it’s frequently down.
01:00:39.000 --> 01:00:40.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:00:41.000 --> 01:00:43.000
SutnerS: It’s incredibly old.
01:00:43.000 --> 01:00:50.000
SutnerS: It is a pain in the butt to everybody who runs it and rides it.
01:00:47.000 --> 01:00:49.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:00:50.000 --> 01:00:52.000
SutnerS: It just, it’s time.
01:00:51.000 --> 01:00:56.000
Stuart Winchester: I agree, and that was my number 5 as well, and I…
01:00:56.000 --> 01:01:02.000
Stuart Winchester: you know, talking to Steve Wright, he’s made the comment to me that he does not like trams. It’s honestly…
01:01:02.000 --> 01:01:14.000
Stuart Winchester: I wouldn’t mind if they split Jay up and just had a low-capacity double going from the top of the flyer up there, because most people don’t need to be at the top of Jay Peak anyway, because it gets…
01:01:14.000 --> 01:01:21.000
Stuart Winchester: kind of nasty, honestly, like, terrain-wise, off the top. So… so yeah, I think the JPEG tram can go…
01:01:21.000 --> 01:01:24.000
Stuart Winchester: What is your number four, Sean?
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:28.000
SutnerS: Uh, anything at Canon?
01:01:27.000 --> 01:01:30.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay.
01:01:30.000 --> 01:01:45.000
SutnerS: Any lift, you pick it. Tram, a quad, a summit. No, not a summit quad. It’s not even a summit quad. No, the summit quad is that really creaky old one that sways in the high winds and kind of scary. And getting on it is kind of scary.
01:01:44.000 --> 01:01:45.000
Stuart Winchester: Mm-hmm.
01:01:45.000 --> 01:01:54.000
SutnerS: Put that one there, and even their high-speed quad from the base is really old now. Um, that’s… and, and, and a few other lifts.
01:01:49.000 --> 01:01:50.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:01:53.000 --> 01:01:58.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, I think they really… so, this Canon tram, which ran right here.
01:01:58.000 --> 01:02:04.000
Stuart Winchester: And if you go to the older trail maps, you can see it. So the problem with Canon is it’s state-owned.
01:02:04.000 --> 01:02:08.000
Stuart Winchester: And the tram was the first one.
01:02:08.000 --> 01:02:18.000
Stuart Winchester: I think in North America. And they took it out a couple years ago. Can you see where it ran? And it used to run summer and winter. It was an attraction, and I think it netted money for the state.
01:02:18.000 --> 01:02:34.000
Stuart Winchester: they took it out, or at least deactivated, maybe it’s still in place, and they don’t have a replacement, they’ve been talking about it for years. Talk a little bit about that, and do you think we will ever see a lift here? Because I also had this as… on my list, it wasn’t number 4, but…
01:02:34.000 --> 01:02:41.000
Stuart Winchester: I had it as number 3, is… I at first thought, because of cost, maybe go Gondola. JD, the old…
01:02:41.000 --> 01:02:49.000
Stuart Winchester: general manager there talked me into the tram and its iconicness, but what do you think should go here? I mean, just focusing on this lift line.
01:02:49.000 --> 01:03:05.000
SutnerS: Same with me. I got talked into the tram when initially being in favor of the gondola, cheaper gondola. I do want to see a tram there. It’s caught in state government purgatory. It came in $25 million over budget.
01:02:55.000 --> 01:02:56.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:03:01.000 --> 01:03:03.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:03:05.000 --> 01:03:12.000
SutnerS: Um, just that overage is worth more than the cost of replacing all the other lifts at Canon.
01:03:11.000 --> 01:03:12.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:03:12.000 --> 01:03:25.000
SutnerS: Um, it seems almost intractable. Uh, I want to say the polymarket odds on that, my own odds on that, are, uh, are maybe for the 29-30 season.
01:03:14.000 --> 01:03:15.000
Stuart Winchester: Right.
01:03:23.000 --> 01:03:25.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay.
01:03:25.000 --> 01:03:29.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, the price seems to just continue going up. Personally.
01:03:29.000 --> 01:03:45.000
Stuart Winchester: I think a model that might work. You look at Spirit Mountain, I looked at the RFP for Spirit Mountain, which is government-owned in Minnesota, and they were looking for an operator, and they weren’t going to charge them any lease fees, but they had to make a guarantee that they would invest $25 million or something. That’s not the right number.
01:03:45.000 --> 01:03:59.000
Stuart Winchester: in the mountain over the next several years. That’s what I think they should do with Canon. You look at Mount Sunapee, it’s run by Vail, and maybe… I’m not saying Vail should run Canon, but find a… you know, lease it out to someone, Altera, Boyne.
01:03:59.000 --> 01:04:12.000
Stuart Winchester: and just let them run it, and just make them promise to invest in it. So yeah, I agree with you. My number 4 was actually the Stratton gondola. I think that thing’s a disaster. It, uh…
01:04:12.000 --> 01:04:24.000
Stuart Winchester: It’s down too often for wind hold. What I think they should put there is a chandelier, because then they could… when the wind is bad for the cabins, they could still run the chairs.
01:04:24.000 --> 01:04:34.000
Stuart Winchester: like, if they had a bubble chondel, they could stow the… the cabin. So, that was my number 4. What is your number, uh, number 3, Sean, for lifts replacements?
01:04:24.000 --> 01:04:25.000
SutnerS: Yep.
01:04:33.000 --> 01:04:34.000
SutnerS: Uh, okay.
01:04:34.000 --> 01:04:38.000
SutnerS: Did I say sugar loaf anything?
01:04:37.000 --> 01:04:41.000
Stuart Winchester: No, let’s talk about it. Would you like to see a sugar loaf.
01:04:39.000 --> 01:04:46.000
SutnerS: Yeah, sure. Especially, what’s that, what’s that six factor on the bottom? There’s, um…
01:04:44.000 --> 01:04:46.000
Stuart Winchester: They don’t have a six-pack, so…
01:04:46.000 --> 01:04:49.000
SutnerS: What’s the 4-pack? They call the… what’s that?
01:04:46.000 --> 01:04:48.000
Stuart Winchester: The Super Quad.
01:04:49.000 --> 01:04:51.000
SutnerS: And what’s super about it?
01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:52.000
Stuart Winchester: Well…
01:04:51.000 --> 01:04:59.000
SutnerS: There’s nothing super about it. It’s down all the time. It it’s there’s huge lines on it. It’s like the eight lanes to get on the thing.
01:04:57.000 --> 01:04:59.000
Stuart Winchester: Mm-hmm.
01:04:59.000 --> 01:05:00.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, okay.
01:04:59.000 --> 01:05:07.000
SutnerS: So there’s that. And then I would like a high speed to the summit. You can do it. It’s possible. That’s it.
01:05:07.000 --> 01:05:21.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, well, they were going to put the 6-pack that came out of Big Sky in there, but according to Liftblog, they’re not going to do that anymore. I also had Super Quad on my list. I think that should be an 8-pack. Boeing has made that investment at…
01:05:21.000 --> 01:05:35.000
Stuart Winchester: 4 of its mountains have apex, and they’ve built 5 total. The sense I get from talking to Boyne officials is that Sugarloaf doesn’t make enough money to justify that, whereas Loon and Sunday River kind of print money. This is what I’m sort of getting from them.
01:05:35.000 --> 01:05:37.000
SutnerS: Of course, yeah.
01:05:36.000 --> 01:05:39.000
Stuart Winchester: Alright, so my number…
01:05:37.000 --> 01:05:38.000
SutnerS: Yes.
01:05:40.000 --> 01:05:43.000
Stuart Winchester: to Sean is…
01:05:44.000 --> 01:05:49.000
Stuart Winchester: The same to one. I think SuperQuad should be an 8-pack.
01:05:49.000 --> 01:05:52.000
Stuart Winchester: Um… around number 1 now? Did you get 4?
01:05:52.000 --> 01:05:57.000
SutnerS: Oh, I think I still have two more to go.
01:05:54.000 --> 01:05:57.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay, number two. Give me number two.
01:05:57.000 --> 01:06:01.000
SutnerS: What did I say this already? Sugarbush. Anything is Sugarbush.
01:05:59.000 --> 01:06:01.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay.
01:06:01.000 --> 01:06:03.000
SutnerS: Did I say that already?
01:06:01.000 --> 01:06:03.000
Stuart Winchester: No, no, no. Talk about Sugar Rush.
01:06:03.000 --> 01:06:18.000
SutnerS: I mean, the lift stock there is really aging. I mean, they’re down all the time. I mean, Slybrook is only open like five days a year. There’s no need for it anyway. Take the shuttle.
01:06:18.000 --> 01:06:23.000
SutnerS: I don’t know, they… when is the last time they put up a brand new high-speed lift there?
01:06:22.000 --> 01:06:30.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, well, they did build one. I know Win Smith built 5 lifts there, so let me take a look.
01:06:30.000 --> 01:06:32.000
SutnerS: But that was ages ago.
01:06:30.000 --> 01:06:39.000
Stuart Winchester: It was, and that was, you know, they sold to Altera in 2019, and let me… I know you gotta run here in a second, but…
01:06:38.000 --> 01:06:42.000
SutnerS: No, no, no, I can go a little longer.
01:06:40.000 --> 01:06:47.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay. Uh, so Sugar… so Sugarbush is a victim of an interesting…
01:06:47.000 --> 01:06:54.000
Stuart Winchester: phenomenon, which is, it got… and Mountain Creek has this same problem. So, in 1995.
01:06:55.000 --> 01:06:59.000
Stuart Winchester: American Skiing Company, in one year.
01:06:59.000 --> 01:07:14.000
Stuart Winchester: Built 5 lifts at Sugarbush, right? So they built the Gatehouse Express, the Northlinks Triple, the Northridge Express, the Slidebrook Express, and Super Bravo Express, all in 1995. Mountain Creek has kind of that same problem, because IntraWest came in in 1998, they.
01:07:14.000 --> 01:07:25.000
Stuart Winchester: built two high-speed quads, a fixed quad, and a, uh, sort of weird bucket lift, the Cabriolet. So, so, so sure, so the problem with it, that was great in 1995.
01:07:20.000 --> 01:07:22.000
SutnerS: Yeah, the vocabulary, yep.
01:07:25.000 --> 01:07:33.000
Stuart Winchester: But then you have… now you have 5 lifts that are 31 years old, and some of those have been moved around. But Sugarbush, let’s see, in 2001.
01:07:33.000 --> 01:07:45.000
Stuart Winchester: They replaced the Castle Rock double with a double, uh, in 2002, so this was all Win Smith. Green Mountain Express, a detached 4, uh, that was a really long lift, uh, that they… I think, actually, that was a relocation.
01:07:45.000 --> 01:07:46.000
Stuart Winchester: Um, and then…
01:07:46.000 --> 01:08:02.000
Stuart Winchester: what else did they do? In 2015, they did, uh, Valley House, a fixed grip 4, and then… oh, he didn’t… yeah, they were all fixed 4, so they did Sunshine and Village in 2017.
01:08:02.000 --> 01:08:05.000
Stuart Winchester: And those are fixed 4s, and then Altera…
01:08:05.000 --> 01:08:21.000
Stuart Winchester: let’s see, they put in a competition T-bar, and then Altera put in, uh, Heaven’s Gate, a fixed four to replace an old triple. So, yeah, they haven’t put in a detach in a long time. So, I believe LiftBlog said they’re putting in a new detach on the Mount Ellen side.
01:08:21.000 --> 01:08:38.000
Stuart Winchester: Soon. So I, I think they’re working slowly, but, uh, but, but we’ll see. So, so that was your number two. My number two, and I’m, I’m sorry for the listeners that I wasn’t more organized with my counting here. I’m gonna, I’m gonna go with one that’s actually already underway. I think the, the goon, the loon gondola is ridiculous.
01:08:38.000 --> 01:08:41.000
Stuart Winchester: I mean, a four-passenger gondola just…
01:08:39.000 --> 01:08:40.000
SutnerS: Yeah.
01:08:41.000 --> 01:08:53.000
Stuart Winchester: it doesn’t work in 2026, especially for the busiest mountain in New Hampshire, historically. Uh, they are… this is already underway, they’re applying with the Forest Service on the same line, pretty much, but they… but, uh…
01:08:53.000 --> 01:09:02.000
Stuart Winchester: Uh, the president came on recently, Brian Norton, onto my podcast, and he told me they’re gonna move the load uphill a little, which I think is smart.
01:09:02.000 --> 01:09:05.000
SutnerS: Yeah, I heard that podcast. That’s a great idea.
01:09:03.000 --> 01:09:14.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, and they’re gonna replace it with a 10-person D-line. This is a monster, 1,738 vertical feet, 6,970 feet long, it’s over a mile long, and they use it year-round. So, so that’s…
01:09:14.000 --> 01:09:18.000
Stuart Winchester: That is my number two. What’s your number one, Sean?
01:09:18.000 --> 01:09:25.000
SutnerS: Well, this is going to be counterintuitive, too, I hope. One of the North Face triples at Mount Snow.
01:09:24.000 --> 01:09:26.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay.
01:09:26.000 --> 01:09:27.000
Stuart Winchester: Okay.
01:09:26.000 --> 01:09:28.000
SutnerS: At least one.
01:09:27.000 --> 01:09:32.000
Stuart Winchester: So not… why not take them both out and get one good lift?
01:09:31.000 --> 01:09:34.000
SutnerS: Bobby, are we done? Thank you, Bobby. Done in one.
01:09:32.000 --> 01:09:38.000
Stuart Winchester: Keep a redundant lift? Okay. Okay, do you… what would you like to see over there?
01:09:34.000 --> 01:09:36.000
SutnerS: Yeah.
01:09:40.000 --> 01:09:46.000
SutnerS: High-speed quad… I’d take a high-speed 6, they probably don’t need that. High-speed qu.
01:09:44.000 --> 01:09:45.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah. Yeah.
01:09:45.000 --> 01:09:48.000
Stuart Winchester: What’s your take on, uh…
01:09:48.000 --> 01:09:50.000
Stuart Winchester: The second six-pack that…
01:09:50.000 --> 01:09:56.000
Stuart Winchester: that Vail put in a couple years ago, as far as efficacy of moving people around?
01:09:57.000 --> 01:10:02.000
SutnerS: Oh, my God. Brilliant. It’s pretty analogous to the one they did at Stoke.
01:10:01.000 --> 01:10:02.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:10:02.000 --> 01:10:18.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, yeah, they did want to do chemo too, so Vail’s done a lot of good investment. Alright, my number one lift that I would like to see replaced, and everyone’s gonna hate me, I think that the 4Runner at Stowe needs to be a 6 or an 8 pack. You look at the top of Stowe, where it dumps off, there are a zillion trails going.
01:10:03.000 --> 01:10:05.000
SutnerS: Right? Yeah.
01:10:18.000 --> 01:10:21.000
Stuart Winchester: Uh, even with that six-pack, it is…
01:10:21.000 --> 01:10:31.000
Stuart Winchester: the alpha of alpha lifts in… it’s one of the best lifts in the country. It’s one of the few lifts in the country where you can get 2,300 vertical feet.
01:10:32.000 --> 01:10:35.000
Stuart Winchester: laps, and just smash it. Like, I…
01:10:33.000 --> 01:10:35.000
SutnerS: Yep.
01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:47.000
Stuart Winchester: I was there, I got there late one day, 10.30, and it was a good day, it was a busy day, and I got, like, 36,000 vertical feet. It was my biggest day of the year, and it definitely wasn’t my longest. So, as far as just…
01:10:47.000 --> 01:11:03.000
Stuart Winchester: burning out laps, and it’s good terrain, man. The front four is there, it’s a lot of glades, a lot of bumps, you get cruisers if you want, and you can see all the way over the intermediate part and come back. But I really think that 4Runner, which is already on its second generation, I think that I would like to see Vail.
01:11:03.000 --> 01:11:10.000
Stuart Winchester: replace that with a 6 or 8. I… the, uh, SOGM Mike Giorgio said, I think the gondola would be their next.
01:11:11.000 --> 01:11:13.000
Stuart Winchester: Priority, so…
01:11:12.000 --> 01:11:14.000
SutnerS: We’ll replace the domino?
01:11:13.000 --> 01:11:20.000
Stuart Winchester: No, uh, I don’t think they would replace it. I think they wanna… I think it needs a modernization.
01:11:19.000 --> 01:11:26.000
SutnerS: New cabins? Yeah, new cabins, stuff like that. But I agree with you on the forerunner. I can’t believe that didn’t make my list.
01:11:21.000 --> 01:11:22.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah, but…
01:11:23.000 --> 01:11:24.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah.
01:11:24.000 --> 01:11:27.000
Stuart Winchester: All right, Sean.
01:11:27.000 --> 01:11:43.000
Stuart Winchester: Always fun to have you on here, man. Really enjoyed chopping it up, and you know what? We’re gonna do this again in a couple weeks, I think, because your column will be firing up. So tell us a little bit about the column, and uh… and when you’re gonna start that, and hopefully we can get you back on the show around that time.
01:11:44.000 --> 01:12:03.000
SutnerS: I’m starting in Thanksgiving Day, as I have for the last 23 years. I don’t know what it’s about yet, which is common. I’ve got a list of things I’m considering. And so, please, anyone listening to this, you can read it if you’re in Central Mass, or even not in Central Mass.
01:11:47.000 --> 01:11:49.000
Stuart Winchester: Mmhm.
01:11:54.000 --> 01:11:56.000
Stuart Winchester: Yeah.
01:12:03.000 --> 01:12:08.000
SutnerS: And it’s at telegram.com, Worcester Telegram Gazette, and that’s my column.
01:12:07.000 --> 01:12:13.000
Stuart Winchester: Alright, awesome. Alright, Sean, thanks a lot, I know you gotta run, really appreciate you, man, always good to chat.
01:12:13.000 --> 01:12:15.000
SutnerS: So much fun. Thank you, Stuart.
